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Ragdolls and Physics


Started by Idriar
Post #99877
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I hope TESO will feature some realistic ragdolls and physics for falling items. Fallen enemies moving even after their death, dead enemies being thrown back by magic and heavy strikes, their limbs and weapons moving on the floor until they settle in an realistic pose... this is what I liked about Morrowind, Oblivion and Skyrim. And of course many other games. I don´t like it when the enemies have exactly one "dying movement" and one "death pose", making every fallen enemy look the same.

But we already know that one won´t be able to move and drag any object around like in Skyrim, and so on. So I´m a little afraid that immersion could be damaged by enemies falling to the ground, remaining there movelessly and vanishing into the ground, or dissolving into nothingness.

Any information about that?


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Post #99879
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Unlikely


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Post #99924
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I would imagine its just far too stressful to employ any significant physics to dying, I too however hope its not just dying the same way every time, I like to think they might at least have several dead positions and dying animations to fit according to different attacks.
For example;
If Death by arrow to the front then use falling to knee's before collapsing forward.
or something along those lines.


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Post #99925
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Its an MMO , its gonna sacrifice immersion for funner gameplay , It can't have all those things you ask for because it'd simply be either really laggy or take to long to code

Although I dont think ragdolls and the physics will be so bad , Enemies will prolly vanish to the ground and turn into a couple of bones like in WoW i believe
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Post #99926
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(September 19th 2013 07:59 PM)Avidus Wrote:  If Death by arrow to the front then use falling to knee's before collapsing forward.
or something along those lines.

Did you just subtly reference arrow to the knee?
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Post #99930
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(September 19th 2013 08:24 PM)babylon Wrote:  
(September 19th 2013 07:59 PM)Avidus Wrote:  If Death by arrow to the front then use falling to knee's before collapsing forward.
or something along those lines.

Did you just subtly reference arrow to the knee?

he might not be aware he did, but, well if he didn't you certasinly did.
phew, glad that's covered.


Pretty sure Eso is going to use havoc. so some certain amount of stuff will have physics collisions. I imagine bodies will ragdoll
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Post #99931
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Its all about the hidden messages!
I needed an example.


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Post #99934
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As long as there isnt just one death position then im okay with not being able to move bodies around as i please


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Post #99937
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Things that amuse me at death:
The enemy saying "I will vanquish you/!" "You are conquered!" when they, in fact, are already dead.
A slain enemy hanging in the air in the death position.
Slain enemy's weapon suspended in the air - although it irks me that I can't just reach out and grab it for my own use.

Things that irritated me at death:
Slain bodies laying around my newly conquered house. I hated how bodies lingered in OB as opposed to quickly disappearing ala MW.

Havoc engines go only so far and have to be employed with discretion by the devs. It is totally unrealistic to walk too near a table and have all the objects on it go flying off into space. Glorious and gorey death scenes will depend more on death animations, timing & scripting than on a havoc engine.


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Post #101157
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Sadly physics and Ragdolls will NOT likely be implemented seeing as the game is an MMO this is reasonable...but still takes away from the TES feel of it.


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Post #101193
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_243r5ccDA

That's what you can expect for the most part.


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Post #101577
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I think implementing ragdoll and physics for tens of thousands of mobs being killed every second will put way too much stress on the server, that's also why you won't have the option to drop items on the ground like you would in any TES game, way too much things for the server to render, adding unnecessary lag


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Post #137341
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You know, I'm bored here... and don't really care about TESO nor care for ragdolls (in summary, if a death blow causes that much force... why didn't it cause it when I was attacking?); but you overestimate the complexity of implementing ragdolls.

First off, understand how a game like Diablo worked back in the day. The server did not transfer the location of each and every player / mob / projectile... that would be absurd (remember 56k modems). It transfered the "motion vector", and "multiple projectile spells" generally had a repeatable pattern (some exceptions) that meant only the origin needed be transfered and the "spread" of the projectiles could be calculated hence.

From this, it should be obvious that it is absurd to transfer in realtime the "ragdoll animations;" you only need to supply two values, the impulse vector and the randomseed (if applicable.) The client does all the calculations, the server doesn't really need to even know WHERE the body is (it could return to the default "kill position" after people leave the area) or could use extremely simplified algorithms to calculate where it might be (not realtime or iterative calculations, simple stuff such as v = sqrt(2 * d * g) ** and of course, this would be better; but just saying that it isn't exactly required**).

[Technically, although insecure, the neighboring clients could calculate where the body lands and relay that back to the server.]


And before you get into economies of scale, take a look at the current "economy"; millions of mobs having AI routines run in realtime (NOT XD; only if players are around to observe them). And you have server side collision calculations to prevent players from using client side hacks (although, those can be simplified greatly). When you look at how much is already going on, saying "tens of thousands of death calculations a second" sounds rather banal in comparison to the number of calculations being performed already.


Eitherway, I was bored.... so goodbye.
This post was last modified: January 25th 2014 09:46 AM by Croapa
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Post #177466
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Well, if they implement ragdolls and (some) physics client side, and then make an option to disable advanced ragdolling and physics in your settings (for slow computers), then it should be 100% possible. Ragdolls does not need to be accurate, and therefor doesn't need to be managed by the server.
In many games, the ragdolls are - in fact - client side.
Other physics objects, like potions, can't be client side, as they serve a much more important role. Whereas other stuff like skulls is more or less useless to actual gameplay, and therefor doesn't need to be server side.
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