Who Makes Better "Stealthy Mages", Altmer, or Dunmer?

So, I've been seriously considering this question in my mind... who makes better stealthy mages, Altmer, or Dunmer? Well, your first thought is probably "Dunmer", afterall, that race is designed to be, well, "stealthy mages"... But who would REALLY be better at it?

I'd like to point out that I'm coming at this from a "lore" or "story" perspective, not a gameplay perspective, because in reality, the game developers can OP, or UP just about anything.

So, from a lore perspective, I would say Altmer, and no, it's not just because I intend to play one, but here's why:

Going by Skyrim stats which you can see here, (again, just to get a general idea of what each race is good at, not talking about the gameplay of Skyrim itself) Dunmer do have "sneak", yes, and they get a nice bonus to destruction, which is cool, but Altmer, are the "Illusionists", they have the highest Illusion in the game...

ALSO they aren't lacking in any school, like the Dunmer lack in Conjuration. You have to keep in mind, that in the Illusion line, you have spells like, "Invisibility", and "Move Silently".

SO then, who's more stealthy, the one who can turn invisible and move silently, in the middle of a crowded, well-lit room, OR the person who's just "sneaky". I could compare this to the Lord of The Rings (for example), who's better at being unseen, Aragon, the Ranger, or Frodo/Bilbo, when they're wearing the ring? (I just went overboard in nerdsville, I know, I know-oh).

Also, I've found, that from playing Skyrim, Conjuration was a huge benefit when it came to stealth, because it allows you to send minions into the fray, while you stay in the shadwos, whereas Destruction magic tends to bring the enemies attention right to you, and again, Dunmer get no bonus whatsoever to conjuration...

So, it is my contention, that since Altmer have the best Illusion in the game, and are the most well-rounded mages, getting bonuses to every single school of magic, where Dunmer lack in Conjuration, and Bretons in destruction, they have it all, so who makes the better "stealthy mage"? I would say Altmer...

Altmer are the best at everything.

If everything is just being a wizard, then yes.

(February 23rd 2013, 04:03 PM)Qallidex Wrote: So, I've been seriously considering this question in my mind... who makes better stealthy mages, Altmer, or Dunmer? Well, your first thought is probably "Dunmer", afterall, that race is designed to be, well, "stealthy mages"... But who would REALLY be better at it?

I'd like to point out that I'm coming at this from a "lore" or "story" perspective, not a gameplay perspective, because in reality, the game developers can OP, or UP just about anything.

So, from a lore perspective, I would say Altmer, and no, it's not just because I intend to play one, but here's why:

Going by Skyrim stats

So much for coming at it from a "lore" or "story" perspective :P

But really, the point of being a stealth mage is so that you don't have to waste your mana on "invisibility" all the time. Or blow the fact that you're there by recasting it in the middle of an infiltration before it expires.

Leveraging Alchemy into potions of invisibility actually works better than relying on pure illusion. Alchemy offsets all weaknesses, really. And guess who's got bonuses to Alchemy in Skyrim? Dunmer (and Bretons) - not Altmer.

Yes, I am bucking the trend and choosing Dunmer.

(February 23rd 2013, 07:57 PM)Venitas the Heretic Wrote:

(February 23rd 2013, 04:03 PM)Qallidex Wrote: So, I've been seriously considering this question in my mind... who makes better stealthy mages, Altmer, or Dunmer? Well, your first thought is probably "Dunmer", afterall, that race is designed to be, well, "stealthy mages"... But who would REALLY be better at it?

I'd like to point out that I'm coming at this from a "lore" or "story" perspective, not a gameplay perspective, because in reality, the game developers can OP, or UP just about anything.

So, from a lore perspective, I would say Altmer, and no, it's not just because I intend to play one, but here's why:

Going by Skyrim stats

So much for coming at it from a "lore" or "story" perspective :P

But really, the point of being a stealth mage is so that you don't have to waste your mana on "invisibility" all the time. Or blow the fact that you're there by recasting it in the middle of an infiltration before it expires.

Leveraging Alchemy into potions of invisibility actually works better than relying on pure illusion. Alchemy offsets all weaknesses, really. And guess who's got bonuses to Alchemy in Skyrim? Dunmer (and Bretons) - not Altmer.

Yea, but Altmer have more mana to begin with, and more mana regeneration, so they can burn a tiny amount on invisibility spells (it really doesn't take that much) isn't that big of a deal, and they can buy invisibility potions to if they want, you don't have to make them in order to drink 'em. Also, I used the Skyrim stats to get a general idea of what each race is capable of, not to reference how things work in skyrim itself.

Edit: Also, spells in the Elder Scrolls world are generally casted pretty quickly and quietly, so hiding for half a second, and recasting it in the middle of an infiltration, really isn't a big deal.

Hm... toughie... I suppose they work equally. The Illusion bonus lets you get the Silent Casting perk earlier, but I would think that Sneak is easier to level up (aside from repeatedly casting Muffle).

(February 23rd 2013, 07:29 PM)Epicface Wrote: If everything is just being a wizard, then yes.

I'm a wizard irl

(February 23rd 2013, 09:19 PM)Velaskae Wrote:

(February 23rd 2013, 07:29 PM)Epicface Wrote: If everything is just being a wizard, then yes.

I'm a wizard irl

Who isn't a wizard

(February 23rd 2013, 09:19 PM)Velaskae Wrote:

(February 23rd 2013, 07:29 PM)Epicface Wrote: If everything is just being a wizard, then yes.

I'm a wizard irl

30 years is a long time.

Lol, I think people are just coming to the thread, and picking Dunmer, without even thinking about it, or reading the thread, lol. Fail

(February 23rd 2013, 09:55 PM)Qallidex Wrote: Lol, I think people are just coming to the thread, and picking Dunmer, without even thinking about it, or reading the thread, lol. Fail

Or they realize that the race that gets a bonus to sneak and destruction is a better stealth mage.

(February 23rd 2013, 10:30 PM)Knightmare Wrote:

(February 23rd 2013, 09:55 PM)Qallidex Wrote: Lol, I think people are just coming to the thread, and picking Dunmer, without even thinking about it, or reading the thread, lol. Fail

Or they realize that the race that gets a bonus to sneak and destruction is a better stealth mage.

Really? Better than the race that has the best Illusion in the game, which includes spells like Invisibility, Move Silently/Muffle, and isn't handicapped by not having a major spell school like conjuration, and gets bonuses to Magicka to boot? Not sure anyone's thinking this through, so I'll reiterate:

Invisibility/Muffle > Tip-Toeing around, hoping you don't get seen

(February 23rd 2013, 09:28 PM)decoy Wrote:

(February 23rd 2013, 09:19 PM)Velaskae Wrote:

(February 23rd 2013, 07:29 PM)Epicface Wrote: If everything is just being a wizard, then yes.

I'm a wizard irl

30 years is a long time.

30 years for what?

(February 23rd 2013, 10:34 PM)Qallidex Wrote:

(February 23rd 2013, 10:30 PM)Knightmare Wrote:

(February 23rd 2013, 09:55 PM)Qallidex Wrote: Lol, I think people are just coming to the thread, and picking Dunmer, without even thinking about it, or reading the thread, lol. Fail

Or they realize that the race that gets a bonus to sneak and destruction is a better stealth mage.

Really? Better than the race that has the best Illusion in the game, which includes spells like Invisibility, Move Silently/Muffle, and isn't handicapped by not having a major spell school like conjuration, and gets bonuses to Magicka to boot? Not sure anyone's thinking this through, so I'll reiterate:

Invisibility/Muffle > Tip-Toeing around, hoping you don't get seen

Except that casting invisibility tells everyone that you're there.